Wisconsin Governor and potential presidential candidate Scott Walker apparently thinks it is not an unreasonable idea to consider building a wall between Canada and the United States in order to secure his country’s borders from security threats. Now, to be fair, he did not say that a wall should be built along the 5,525 mile long border – only that it was an issue worth looking into. According to Walker: “Some people have asked us about that in New Hampshire.” This of course comes on the tail of Donald Trump and his call to build a wall on the US-Mexico border – and have Mexico pay for it.
Well, it is summer silly season and on a warm summer day, contemplating all this over a nice cold Canadian beer certainly has its pleasures. I suppose building the Great Wall of Canada would certainly be the infrastructure project of the century. I wonder if Paul Krugman somehow put Walker up to this with his recent talk of ‘moveable gluts’ and too many savings chasing too few goods? Is this the kind of deficit financed infrastructure spending Justin Trudeau would support? And of course, given that Governor Walker is from Wisconsin, I would be curious about how he proposes to deal with Lake Superior (or Lakes Huron, Erie and Ontario for that matter). Pontoon fences?
Good fences do make for good neighbours and of course, being a practical northern Ontarian my first thought is what kind of ‘fence’ should this be? Chain link? Barbed wire? Treated wood? Concrete slabs? How about an ice wall as done on the northern border of the kingdoms of Westeros in Game of Thrones? Or perhaps, what is in mind is a variant of the Israel-Gaza border barrier? The Israel-Gaza security barrier apparently costs about 2 million dollars per kilometer and the original route was to be over 450 miles (about 725 kilometers). Our border with the USA is 8,891 kilometres of which 2,477 is shared with Alaska alone. There are also 119 border crossing which I guess means that alot of fence gates will have to be built.
At 2 million dollars per kilometer (Israel-Gaza pricing), you are probably looking at about 18 billion dollars. Of course, there are cheaper alternatives. According to this Government of Saskatchewan web site (and they know lots about fencing on the prairies), you can build a four-wire electric 6-foot high fence with treated wood posts for about $4,216 per mile. This would run to only about 23.2 million dollars but I suspect the maintenance costs would be quite high. However, I suppose the fence could be "green" and use wind and solar power to electrify the barrier.
Then of course, there is the issue of who should pay for the fence. I suppose if we invoke the Coase Theorem, then it does not matter as efficiency is restored no matter who pays as the externalities are internalized. In many Canadian municipalities, the convention is that property fences are shared when it comes to expenses. Hopefully, if the fence is built, it will spark a large demand for Canadian resource commodities needed as construction inputs on the US side and hence beef up our currency a bit.
Seriously. As amusing as this is, this is a very important border in terms of trade and travel as this link illustrates. Over one billion dollars a day in trade crosses the Canada-US border and Canadians and Americans make nearly 70 million cross-border trips a year. I am not going to sit on the fence on this one. Honestly, we should be building bridges, not fences.
The wall should be constructed of compacted snow.
Posted by: Sandwichman | August 30, 2015 at 07:45 PM
You could build it out of the bricks that pass for policy ideas from the Republican candidates. Seriously,is this all some sort of elaborate put-on by John Steward?
Posted by: Bob Smith | August 31, 2015 at 08:03 AM
Well I think that a wall is a great idea! Its going to keep the Zombies armies out of Canada, 'cause if we built it they will come. Secondly, when President Trump decided to invade Canada, because "its really our oil", the wall will slow them down just a bit. As I contemplate the GOP primaries over a cold one, I wonder why Canada's political season is so boring. Thanks to America we have a bountiful load of crazies to entertain us all. Good bless America, God bless Citizen United -- without all these billionaire nut jobs to finance this wide range of crazies summer would be so very very boring.
Posted by: Nicolas Forget | August 31, 2015 at 09:37 AM
I'm thinking the wall may be more useful in keeping out the herds of American refugees fleeing the prospect of President Trump. Come to think of it, that's probably how he'll get Mexico to pay for their wall too.
I'm looking forward to the Republican National Convention. The moment when Ashton Kutcher rips off his Donald Trump mask and tells the crowd they've been Punk'd will be priceless.
Posted by: Bob Smith | August 31, 2015 at 11:34 AM
In some respects this is the perfect 'shovel-ready' project. The border exists and by agreement must be maintained such that it is always visible. Of course in all other respects it is completely insane or just an example of Poe's law in action https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law
Posted by: Steve | August 31, 2015 at 04:05 PM
I just want this to be a private-public partnership, so I can get the advertising space rights for the whole wall and get rich. Imagine the demand there must be to put billboards along the Saskatchewan-Montana border.
Posted by: Shangwen | August 31, 2015 at 05:09 PM
@Bob, The moment when Ashton Kutcher rips off his Donald Trump mask and tells the crowd they've been Punk'd will be priceless." ... Yes, yes, it will!
Posted by: Tom Brown | August 31, 2015 at 08:13 PM
@Nicolas, "I wonder why Canada's political season is so boring." ... and you guys were showing some real signs of life there with Rob Ford... what happened??? Somebody really dropped the ball (missed the slap-shot?) up there. Tell you what, you want to trade? We'll send Ted Cruz back for him.
Posted by: Tom Brown | August 31, 2015 at 08:18 PM
I don't see a problem with this idea. People like walls. It's been great for Chinese tourism. Pink Floyd's "The Wall" remains one of the biggest selling albums of all time. Walls are clearly good business.
Posted by: PederJakobsen | September 01, 2015 at 08:28 AM
And as cultural icons, walls are great. There's the Berlin Wall, Hadrian's wall, the walls of Jericho. Build Walker's Wall, and in two thousand years the children of our alien overlords will be learning about Governor Walker and his wall.
Posted by: Bob Smith | September 01, 2015 at 10:36 AM
We shouldn't be too smug. If we didn't have the US as a buffer state, we might be building a wall ourselves. We let in a lot of people, but are rather picky about who we let in, and like to feel it is under our control.
Posted by: Nick Rowe | September 01, 2015 at 10:53 AM
True, but the history of big wall building suggests that they're not great at keeping people out (or in, as the case may be) - The Great Wall, Hadrian's Wall, the Walls of Jericho and, ultimately, the Berlin Wall, all failed in that regard. And while one could argue that the Berlin Wall worked for 30 years, unless you're willing to staff your wall with battalions of machine-gun toting bureaucrats (to use one of Len Deighton's better lines), land mines and motion triggered machine guns, that's hardly a great precedent. The Europeans have a moat(the Meditteranean) that's - what? - 100 miles wide, and it doesn't seem to be working for them. The First Nations had a moat (the Atlantic) that was a few thousand kilometers wide, but that didn't work too well for them either.
Posted by: Bob Smith | September 01, 2015 at 11:47 AM
@Bob, agree 100%. The wall version of what's happening in the Mediterranean is coming soon. Strap your children onto a drone that you purchased a Future Shop, and hop over the wall to Canada.
What's happening in Europe is truly a horrific tragedy, but who is to say that equal risks will not be taken by Americans if they run out of water in the next 30-40 years (which they will). You'll need some crazy wall to keep thirsty people away from our pristine lakes.
Posted by: PederJakobsen | September 01, 2015 at 02:04 PM
Obviously Trump should pay for the fence. Especially as it does not matter who pays for it. ;)
Posted by: Min | September 01, 2015 at 06:24 PM
Should keep Ted Cruz out ;)
Posted by: Bob | September 02, 2015 at 04:16 AM
I asked about whether Ben would be an okay president. He is a neurologist or surgeon and my post smart-friendship most identified knowledge field was brain sciences. They said he was an example of a person who would be a good advisor but not a good president. He hasn't studied politics at all.
Bob, the walls you mentioned all worked well. We will always have a higher standard of living than Americans. We were founded by immigrants that respected good gvmt and knowledge. They got some Scottish Enlightenment and Loyalists, but also Italian immigrants that didn't understand commerce, and slavery, and a dislike of (UK) gvmt. The wall would keep them out of Canada.
Posted by: Best Beta Trading | September 02, 2015 at 12:39 PM
...the said being a CEO was not a gone CV for USA President. I was wondering about the computer CEO. I suppose how aggressively he lobbied for computer R+D is of greater primacy. If he directed USA policy towards good gvmt, and good checks on power, and used future computers and foreign policy to sensor for AI projects, this is much better than increasing GDP by supporting unrestricted computer R+D over the decades/generations that leads to AI.
Posted by: Best Beta Trading | September 02, 2015 at 12:42 PM
"At 2 million dollars per kilometer (Israel-Gaza pricing), you are probably looking at about 18 billion dollars. "
The cost of the fence is the real resources used to create it ;)
#MMT
Posted by: Bob | September 05, 2015 at 01:23 PM
So, I was thinking liquid water and CO2 CCS will probably work in some geologies. It is a result of fake plastic trees, Klausner's. But this weekend I got anti-bioterror blueprints for among other things, a 1nm gold, 1-2 mm think kernmantle I think, middle layer, and I think 1mm copper inner layer facing the 12 Monkeys colony or zoo. So, my lobby positions for oil are in flux...
Posted by: Best Beta Trading | September 08, 2015 at 12:11 PM
Most existing CCS R+D is for CO2 gas. It looks like liquid water mixed with CO2 is superior. It appears (often a few papers mention a bit about liquid water and CO2) it is more likely the liquid will go to the bottom or at least not diffuse to the highest impermeable barrier. I am worried the CO2 will outgas from the water. When Americans start using utilitarianism, they can have banks and the oil industry fund fake plastic trees. Ideal is a carbonate geology where 1/3 looks safe to turn into rock. Desert springs away from fault lines appear to be the best water source; IDK how pure Klaus's water source needs to be. That hermetic seal is a universal seal. In 200 yrs we could use silver and shoot neutrinos or something like that at the silver nanoparticles to make them usable as such.
The (if it is) kernmantle is the toughest part. Some materials science genius is going to have to figure out how to get it into a thin textile or whatever you call this seal. That is why I wish the oil industry and the SUA banks would disarm their present lobby path and focus upon petro chemicals and a long-term prosperous society for their grand grandkids, instead of the next earnings report. I got where I am in part by matching wits with animals elements and insects for my very survival. They earnings shortfall is endurable: you can do it CEOs!
After a pathogen reaches the copper last line of defense (and is structural support), go to emergency tents or Mars colony type structures; unless you didn't tax enough to invest in such mostly gvmt R+D. And wait for robots to repair and decontaminate. This suggests to me a hospital decontamination robot (this counts as infrastructure in provincial hospitals at least) is a large industry in the future...
The principle of Responsible Government is the reason we went to war right away. And when a risk occurs that existing an Party is unable to even understand, an election is all that is needed.
On a tech roll: they are suggesting a phased CCTV or perhaps housing option. Any sort of outburst is able to be sensored for. Then look closely for mentally ill signs. A brain sensor is an ideal may to prevent murder, but looking for shouting in more realistic in the next few years. Being loud/erratic isn't a crime, and maybe shouldn't trigger arrest for other things, but it is a prelude to crime and this crime can maybe be stopped by police. There are many grey areas esp domestic violence.
Posted by: Best Beta Trading | September 09, 2015 at 12:02 PM
...If the plastic is attacked, either add a disinfectant or a disinfectant followed by more plastic. People will be always monitoring the hermetic seal from inside the habitat. This is the future if we keep taxes low. I'm expecting stuff like insect drone policy and zombies that have the ability to engineer and/or operated engineered equipment but lost all morals (Quebec was mocked for preparing for this future junkie scenario). Sex will be fun as gene therapied selves (A 2nd cell membrane that controls pathogens flows in and out) because we will have drugs that make sex even better than now even if our skin looks different.
Apparently will be horrified enough to moderate me because is a moron about fiscal policy and makes a living off lobbying for low tax rates.
Posted by: Best Beta Trading | September 09, 2015 at 04:25 PM